No Minister

Speaks for itself

So, uh, yeah, just going to leave this here, then:

Written by Psycho Milt

June 8, 2020 at 7:01 am

Posted in New Zealand

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37 Responses

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  1. Well done, NZ and Jacinda Ardern.Just in time to melt a few snowflakes.

    Gabor

    June 8, 2020 at 7:21 am

  2. I suggest an inspiration to to the world. Why is it that all the countries that come out of this with flying colours..New Zealand, Taiwan, Germany and Denmark..are left of centre governments led by women while the tough talking conservative rightwing male governments are disaster areas…just asking?Petri Dish

    Anonymous

    June 8, 2020 at 7:43 am

  3. That's just cruel, Psycho. After all Tom, Vet and Adolt have been through already. They've had to defend the near criminal incompetence of Trump, Johnson and Bolsonaro while attempting to undermine our response. Now we're fully out of restrictions ahead of all of them and all you can do is run their noses in it. Shame.

    Snowflake

    June 8, 2020 at 7:52 am

  4. @AnonymousI think the countries that had lower death rates are the ones thatisolated their population early but also got infectious cases ofthe virus later than others as it appears to become less lethal overtime as it mutates to something more resembling the seasonal 'flu.Denmark has 101 deaths per million populationCanada has 204 deaths per million populationFrance has 446 deaths per million population

    fredonas

    June 8, 2020 at 8:03 am

  5. Flake … enjoy your moment of gloat if that's what rings your bell but I'm not sure the 1,000 Warehouse employees told they were losing their jobs today will be doing much cheering. Heh … you can say a lot of things about me but Trump supporter I'm not … it's just that I try to be a little more balanced in my comments about him.

    The Veteran

    June 8, 2020 at 8:28 am

  6. WTF has The Warehouse announcement got to do with Trump or Covid-19?The Warehouse Group chief executive Nick Grayston said \”Monday's proposal would have happened regardless of Covid-19.\”.retail is changing, more and more business is moving online, and that has been happening for the last 5 years. The Warehouse also put a millstone around its neck with Noel Leeming, a purchase it made solely so it could obtain \”big brand\” Whitegoods for Warehouse stores.So, how about you stop thread jacking and congratulate \”the gummint\” for a job well done.

    Rex Mundi

    June 8, 2020 at 8:44 am

  7. Don't think the trail of destruction in Ardern's wake really justifies the 'Hero' word.Yeah, I know I'm an outlier.

    Lucia Maria

    June 8, 2020 at 9:05 am

  8. So Belgium with the highest death rate in the world with a female prime minister is just an outlier then?Do the other 22 countries/territories with zero active cases do not count?

    workingman

    June 8, 2020 at 9:20 am

  9. It’s not so much that you’re an outlier, but that you’re simply wrong on the facts. The alternative “let it burn” approach would have seen thousands of deaths and economic carnage. Or would you have preferred the bumbling incompetence of the macho men Trump, Johnson and Bolsonaro?

    Snowflake

    June 8, 2020 at 9:23 am

  10. The other 22 countries are tiny micro states like the Isle of Man, the Vatican and the Faroe Islands or have unreliable reporting like Papua New Guinea or Eritrea. We are the only country who had a case load larger than 350 who has eliminated the Trump virus. Why not take a bow “working man”, it’s a pretty phenomenal effort. Now you can get back to work (although I suspect you’re actually a retired old white guy with a chip on its shoulder).

    Snowflake

    June 8, 2020 at 9:29 am

  11. Don't think the trail of destruction in Ardern's wake really justifies the 'Hero' word.Thing is, in this case the \”trail of destruction\” has us easing restrictions with a case load of 0, unlike most other places that are easing restrictions with substantial case loads still active. Economic destruction has been a feature everywhere this virus has turned up. It's not like there was a choice between large-scale illness and death OR economic destruction, it was always a choice between how much of BOTH you'd like, and the leadership the post refers to reflects the fact that we don't have BOTH to the extent that places like Sweden, the UK or the USA do. This is going to be in the history books for a long time, and in a good way. I'm assuming National is going to have to suck that up for a while, same as Labour had to 10 years ago.

    Psycho Milt

    June 8, 2020 at 9:54 am

  12. So Flake, tell us why Queensland, and in fact most Australian states do better than us as far as deaths per mil population without the draconian lockdowns? “World class leader” is all mouth and no trousers as my grandmother would have said. All PR spin and no substance. Lies like a rug – “early and hard” but one of many examples of spin over fact and substance.Paranormal

    Anonymous

    June 8, 2020 at 10:00 am

  13. “World class leader” is all mouth and no trousers as my grandmother would have said.Did your grandmother often spout bullshit? Australia still has its internal borders closed, let alone the international ones. and it still has a significant caseload of community transmission, such that we'd be mugs to re-open our own borders to them. Our economy's open again from tomorrow for NZers, at which point it's every other cunt that's holding things up, not us. Trying to blame Jacinda Ardern for other governments' shortcomings is ridiculous.

    Psycho Milt

    June 8, 2020 at 10:12 am

  14. So Flake, tell us why Queensland, and in fact most Australian states do better than us as far as deaths per mil population without the draconian lockdowns? Is that the same Queensland that I can't enter to visit my grandsons?And, if by some miracle, I do mange to get there, I will then have to endure a 14 day self isolation when I return home to Corio?Yep, it IS that Queensland.

    Rex

    June 8, 2020 at 11:56 am

  15. Mappa Mundi said……The words of the all knowing Tom forever cast in stone.\”Anyone who thinks they can eliminate the virus is clearly insane\”Nuff said.

    Anonymous

    June 8, 2020 at 2:34 pm

  16. It's all smoke and mirrors of course.If you don't test for the prescence of the virus it can cease to exist and someone presenting with the symptoms just will have a common coldAnd if someone should develop viral pneumonia and die, an everyday event BTW, then without the test being performed their death certificate will read \”complications from COPD\” or something similar.All smoke and mirrors to confuse the gulliable led by proponants of Big Government, panic mongers in the media, and autistic \”scientists\” who play with computer models in their ivory towers.New varints of the corona virus will continue appear on a regular basis, people will still catch colds and the old and sick will continue to die, often from viral pneumonia. And ooner or later everyone in New Zealand will encounter this particular variant of corona virus if they haven't already.Jacinda Ardern can claim that she saved lives\” but that is the claim of a charlatan believed only by foolish peasants without a scintilla of common sense.What would be inteesting to know is did New Zealand's mortality rate rose or fell from the norm in any significant way during the lockdown and that is something that will be obscured from us plebians by our betters

    Andrei

    June 8, 2020 at 7:01 pm

  17. Well subnormal, when your deaths per million are as tiny as ours are then there will be slight variations. Likely explainable by the Rosewood cluster sadly. Queensland is still locked down though so you will have to have your Mum take you on the roller coasters some other time.

    Snowflake

    June 8, 2020 at 7:04 pm

  18. Thank you for proving my point Milt. The fact remains Queensland has done what we should have done from the start. Get tough on the border (you know where we were sloppy not hard) but still allow businesses to operate. Their death rate is better than ours yet they didn’t go full retard on the lockdown like your heroine. But then that inconvenient truth gets in the way of Jacinda worship.Paranormal

    Anonymous

    June 8, 2020 at 7:04 pm

  19. I see, Andrei. Very Bolsonaro of you. Just stop looking and it will magically disappear. Like a miracle. I wonder what all those excess deaths are though? Not here of course, we don’t have any (to respond to the hopeful musing in your final sentence).

    Snowflake

    June 8, 2020 at 7:07 pm

  20. Jesus subnormal. Aust border controls were put in place at roughly the same time ours were. Including Queensland. And guess what, they’re still living with internal travel controls. You’re welcome.

    Snowflake

    June 8, 2020 at 7:08 pm

  21. I don't know if you are being obtuse Snowflake or if you are just a fucking dullard, perhaps both are true.Unlike political creatures people such as myself demand intellectual rigour in defining how a case of COVID-19 is diagnosed and what exactly constitutes a death from COVID-19, and what distinguishes it from other viral pneumonia fatalities (which are very common)Corona viruses a RNA fragments which hijack our cells to replicate themselves and mutate very quickly, a feature of other respiratory viruses that can afflict us, COVID-19 already has mutated many times and there are at least three known varients.Normally when a corona virus, including COVID-19 gets past our defenses we say we have \”a cold\” and just carry on. The only way of distinguishing a COVID-19 \”cold\” from the common cold is to test for it – but the usual test which uses PCR is not that accurate.Now the hysterical media and politicians have got involved the waters have become incredibly muddied But at the end of the day all that matters is are people dying at a greater rate than is normal and have Government interventions made matters better or worse in that regard.What is clear though is that in the Western World modern medicine and health care has extended life well beyond that of days of yore and that in the West there are large numbers of extremely elderly folks. often congregated together in \”rest homes\” just waiting for the grim reaper to come and when one of these viruses gets into such an establishment we will observe a large number of deaths in a short period of time and consider it unusual, even though death itself is inevitable.What is apparent though is that Nations with large death tolls have large populations of pople who have exeeded the natural lifespan of the human being often by decades

    Andrei

    June 8, 2020 at 8:25 pm

  22. Andrei Andrei Andrei, you are on the wrong side of history here and your way of continuing to flog a dead horse is an embarrassment. There have been tens of thousands of tests done in the 17 days since the last case all negative. Australia went for control and has achieved that. It is extremely unlikely to achieve elimination at their settings. We went for elimination and had a harsher lockdown. No guarantee of success but because of massive buying we pulled it off. Very proud day for NZ and New Zealanders. Yes there are a few variations of virus the genetics can distinguish by different RNA but it’s not thought to effect mortality or transmittability. The deaths per week number has been rising slightly each year and has done so again this year. According to the published figures the deaths per week have not risen since covid arrived. Ian

    Anonymous

    June 8, 2020 at 9:05 pm

  23. In.Ian, Ian – the only embarrassment is your sychophantic adulation of J. Ardern.\”According to the published figures the deaths per week have not risen since covid arrived.\”If they are \”published\” you will of course be able to point us all to where we can see them and examine them for ourselvesBut I strongly doubt you can do this and that that is a statement your just plucked out of thin air which will fool those who willing to be fooled but not those of us with functioning brain matter.Please do accept my challenge and prove me wrong by providing the actual data.

    Andrei

    June 8, 2020 at 10:29 pm

  24. Well, she might be all hat and no cattle (and OTOH she might not) but you’ve got to admire talent even if flawed. I have just been at a morning tea, lots of elderly men at my table, all Nats I would think, yet full of admiration for JA. The Centre Right has a fight on its hands. Still 90 or so days and lots of things to happen but you’ve got to give credit where it’s due. All hands on deck, fellas. Time to contribute.

    Max Ritchie

    June 8, 2020 at 11:27 pm

  25. Psycho, I don't disagree with anything you've said in your comment to me at 10:12 last night.However, Andrei's 7:01 & 8:25 comments this morning reflect my POV perfectly. Just wanted to say that, it's lunch time and my brain needs a rest. Maybe a Catan game on my phone.

    Lucia Maria

    June 9, 2020 at 12:43 am

  26. While we are celebrating heroism, maybe also take a moment to remember (a small portion) of the fallen. https://infogram.com/72f46466-b850-4eae-9dd6-331c944d711dPity they didn't 'try harder'….

    Anonymous

    June 9, 2020 at 1:17 am

  27. NZME and Bauer are victims of the changing landscape of print media, and these job losses were already on the cards.Kathmandu, Farmers, The Warehouse, et al are victims of the changing retail landscape, the move to online shopping and the greed of rent seeking landlords.Virgin Australia was already AU$5 Billion in debt and floundering.Other businesses such as Telcoms, Web Design and Hosting, Technology Suppliers, ISP's, have seen a boom in business and are taking on more staff.

    Rex Mundi

    June 9, 2020 at 2:04 am

  28. \”Other businesses such as Telcoms, Web Design and Hosting, Technology Suppliers, ISP's, have seen a boom in business and are taking on more staff\”Sure….but I'm not sure how many shelf stackers, landcapers, panelbeaters and retail assistants will land gigs with ISPs and web design (….guess they should 'learn to code' huh?). Dismissal of the underclass by the technocratic elite is such as 2020s thing…

    Anonymous

    June 9, 2020 at 2:52 am

  29. Sorry Andrei, I have been out for the day. Don’t know how to post a link but if you type in “are there hidden covid-19 deaths in New Zealand “ a newsroom link will come up. It’s the best I can do. Ian

    Anonymous

    June 9, 2020 at 4:04 am

  30. Sure….but I'm not sure how many shelf stackers, landcapers, panelbeaters and retail assistants will land gigs with ISPs and web design (….guess they should 'learn to code' huh?). That's the flexible workforce Capitalism has been demanding. Funny thing, here in OZ too many companies are being caught out underpaying workers and they all use the same excuse \”The system is too complex\”. That is, the system they demanded, the end of Conciliation, the neutering of Trade Unions, the abolition of Awards, all demanded by Capitalists is too hard for the overpaid bludgers to understand.And for an NZ example, pop over to Homepaddock and see Ele moaning because she can no longer access a pool of cheap, compliant, foreign labour and hasn't done anything to train Kiwis for Dairy careers.

    Rex Mundi

    June 9, 2020 at 4:43 am

  31. Here's a link to the article Ian mentions: Are there hidden Covid-19 deaths in NZ’s statistics?

    Psycho Milt

    June 9, 2020 at 7:14 am

  32. Their death rate is better than ours yet they didn’t go full retard on the lockdown like your heroine.So, the best-case scenario you can find still has active cases and it remains unclear at this point whether their economic damage is less than ours or not. So, the worst thing you can come up with to say about Jacinda Ardern is that her performance may turn out to have been not quite as good as the best-case example you could find. Sounds fair enough to me.

    Psycho Milt

    June 9, 2020 at 7:19 am

  33. Well Ian that is better than I'd thought you would do.It is not particularly illumative though, there is a huge variance in the data, which arises from a number of sources and it deals in absolute numbers not the rate per head of population or per thousand or million of population which is what is required since the size of the population is changing.The problem is you cannot work with slogans or soundbites and you need to strictly define what is to be ascribed as COVID-19 death and when making comparisons between nations youmust ensue the definitions are consistant, which they are notCOVID-19 does not kill patients directly, nor do the other respiratory viruses rather the bodies immune sysem over reacts to their prescence and pneumonia developsTo come to grips with this what will be requires is precise defintions, good data and people with exceptionally good statistical skills to analyse that data – there is no journalist or politician in this country that can do thisIt is quite clear and has been almost sinc the bginning of this event that this particular virus poses no great threat to the young or those in the prime of their lives but for those already living on borrowed time contact with this virus may see their debt called in, if you will pardon the metaphore.It is also obvious to those who think more deeply that respiratory viruses have been part of our ecosphere for millions of years and that J. Ardern and co will never eliminate them, no matter what they do.If indeed the virus has been eliminated from New Zealand, (along with other respiratory viruses?) they will return as soon a we re-establish contact with the outside world and perhaps with a vengence, which is what chaos theory would suggest.I certainly wouldn't be crowing that J. Ardern has beaten the virus if I were you, this is still an ongoing event and how it plays out in the finish will not be known for years.I personally think time will reveal this to be one of the biggest Government bungles of all time…

    Andrei

    June 9, 2020 at 8:26 am

  34. Andrei: I'm growing tired of hosting your \”Covid-19's a doddle\” stories on my blog. You keep posting statements of the obvious (eg it \”will return as soon a we re-establish contact with the outside world\”, \”this is still an ongoing event\”) as though they were deep insights somehow beyond the grasp of us non-conspiracy-theorists, and it's getting tedious. In short: NZ is currently in a better situation than most other countries in dealing with this virus. You don't have to accept my claim that that situation is due to the competence of our government and public service, but spare us the blather about COVID-19 only killing useless eaters – I'm starting to find it really offensive and am increasingly reluctant to have it appearing under my posts.

    Psycho Milt

    June 9, 2020 at 9:17 am

  35. COVID-19 is on the rise again in the United States.Arizona, North Carolina and California are seeing enormous spikes as the virus finds fertile conditions after lockdowns were lifted early.Now they’re nervously awaiting the outcome of intense protests.More than 20 US states have registered an uptick in diagnoses in the past week.But state and federal governments continue to lift quarantine restrictions. All regions began reactivating their economies – to varying degrees – in late May.Two weeks later, it’s evident fears of a pandemic rebound were well-founded.California confirmed 3593 news cases on Friday. The count there has been trending upwards by more than 2000 every day since May 25.North Carolina counted 1370 new cases on Saturday – its highest single-day figure. The previous high was set the day before with 1289 diagnosed.Arizona’s highest single-day increase also came at the weekend, with 1579 new cases on Saturday. The number was a similar 1438 on Sunday.Alaska, Arkansas, Florida, Hawaii, Idaho, Kentucky, Michigan, Missouri, Montana, New Mexico, Oregon, South Carolina, Texas, Tennessee, Utah, Washington and Vermont have also reported renewed rises.And most of these cases were contracted before enormous crowds erupted on the nation’s streets to protest the brutal police killing of unarmed black man George Floyd.More than 1.9 million cases have been recorded in the US since the pandemic began. More than 110,500 have died. And that toll can only now rise.

    Rex Mundi

    June 9, 2020 at 12:38 pm

  36. This post has about run it’s course but I’ll chip in a couple of comments. Andrei, all the deaths here were people who had serious health issues but that hasn’t been the case overseas. Boris is a good example, damm near died and is probably never going to come completely right again. I know the weekly death tally in England and Wales dented your confidence in your views for a while. I suspect that the size of the initial load of virus makes a big difference to the outcome. Max. I too have heard many National supporters praising Ardern but whether they will vote Labour not sure. Remember Churchill was voted out 2 months after VE Day. Muller is a bit slow starting but at least he isn’t peaking early. Rex, people in the US haven’t got a lot of good options, they can’t lockdown now . Be careful you don’t wallow in there misfortune. Not a good look. Sir Fredrick Dagg was wrong. We DO know how lucky we are. Ian

    Anonymous

    June 9, 2020 at 9:57 pm

  37. Yep just a zero

    Anonymous

    June 10, 2020 at 12:59 am


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