No Minister

LARF OR CRY …. YOUR CHOICE

with 24 comments

It was reported that Jacinda Ardern urged her colleague MP’s attending Labour’s caucus retreat in New Plymouth to ‘remain humble’. How she could say that with a straight face fair beats me. All power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. And Labour enjoys absolute power and arrogantly flaunts it making a mockery of the ‘humble’ bit.

Just one example … Three Waters … recently released cabinet papers reveal the consultation process so called was a sham. Ardern’s cabinet had already decided to proceed with the confiscation of ratepayer owned assets before embarking on the farce. Another example … co-governance is alive and well thanks to He Puapua with the Labour Party Maori caucus driving the agenda with the result that many of the rights of the 84% that are non-Maori are to be subjugated to this wishes of a 16% minority … equal standing under the law is being thrown out of the window and the country will pay a high price for that.

One can think of many descriptives one might apply to Jacinda’s mob. Humble ain’t one of them.

New Zealand … the way you’ve got it.

Written by The Veteran

January 23, 2022 at 2:31 pm

24 Responses

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  1. A question Vet: why isn’t the National Party making a fuss about this? Has there been a strong statement from its Leader? Or is he too busy? I note he’s learning Maori, in itself laudable, perhaps, but where’s the attack? This is an issue which has the airwaves alive and, I might add, my usually complacent retirement village on fire (we’ll, smoldering).

    Cassandra

    January 23, 2022 at 2:50 pm

  2. That penultimate word should be well.

    Cassandra

    January 23, 2022 at 2:51 pm

  3. I’ve just had a look at the Nat website. I can’t see anything specific about National rejecting this latest form of apartheid. A five point plan for Glasgow (which I learn is about climate change, not urban development in Scotland) but nothing about this hot issue. Perhaps it’s not a hot issue?

    Cassandra

    January 23, 2022 at 3:14 pm

    • C’mon ….get with it. National has rejected both Three Waters (with Luxon leading the charge on this with Seymour playing catch up) and He Puapua as the way forward. I’m not sure Actoids criticising National or vice versa is necessarily smart politics (although Labour will applaud it} but if you expect me to turn the other cheek to cheap shots then you’ll be disappointed. .

      The Veteran

      January 23, 2022 at 3:36 pm

  4. I guess you could ask the same question of Seymour. The reality is that people are quite capable of assigning to Jacinda’s exhortation the contempt and ridicule due to it without too much outside help. I suspect both Luxon and Seymour have more important things on their mind. Like Jacinda ordering NZL into Red with a (non) plan to back it up consisting of ‘we’ll we making an announcement when you can expect announcements in due course’. Now that’s what the media should be focusing on and kudos tor Luxon for leading the charge in his Stuff article.

    The Veteran

    January 23, 2022 at 3:28 pm

    • Vet I think Luxon and Seymour should be concentrating on three things at present – and only three things:

      1. Opening the borders and getting Omicron out of the way by 30 April while the warm/hot weather helps mitigate it and slow it down. We should be on Green not Red.

      2. The economy – which is on a steep downward slide and eventually New Zealand’s solvency and international reputation will be at risk.

      3. He Puapua – as you say there is no way 15/16% of the New Zealand population can be allowed to dominate and dictate to the rest of the people. We are not South Africa of the 50’s 60’s and 70’s.

      pdm1946

      January 23, 2022 at 4:04 pm

      • Damned if I know where the lines came from.

        pdm1946

        January 23, 2022 at 5:01 pm

      • Well, as you know National supports the current approach. The National press release supported the shift to red. Not one respectable health scientist would say, “just let it rip, everyone can just take their chances, we are just going to apply Darwin’s law of survival of the fittest”. Fortunately no western government is that stupid. And neither is the great majority of the New Zealand public.
        But I presume, when Omicron is widespread, that MIQ will become a thing of the past. However it would be foolish to put a date on that. Covid has a way of confounding such certainties.

        Wayne

        January 23, 2022 at 10:00 pm

      • Ahaaaah pdm. Every comment has a silver lining!

        adolffinkensen

        January 23, 2022 at 10:22 pm

      • “just let it rip, everyone can just take their chances, we are just going to apply Darwin’s law of survival of the fittest”

        That’s a fantastically stupid thing for anyone to say, especially a former Cabinet Minister, but then politicians do love their strawmen. Why it’s almost as if the speaker is saying that our health officials are the finest in the world and that everybody else are idiots. I’m sure that appeals to New Zealanders.

        Meantime in the rest of the world, having watched Omicron “rip” through their triple-vaxxed populations, it seems that some politicians are finally coming to their senses…

        Britain

        And Ireland (“Few fell seriously ill from Omicron wave” – Oh no! Who would have guessed after the horrors of South Africa)

        Let’s hope that’s us in about a month’s time.

        Tom Hunter

        January 23, 2022 at 10:31 pm

      • Tom,

        And yet that is exactly how some commentators have described Australia’s omicron response, “Let it rip”, which is actually a bit unfair. NSW and Victoria have had extensive responses, but they started too late by which time Omicron was already spreading fast in the community.

        My specific comment was to pdm’s recommendation that we should immediately go to green and open the borders no later than April 30. Given green has virtually no controls (other than getting boosters) it pretty much would be a “Let it rip” strategy.

        Wayne

        January 24, 2022 at 11:08 am

      • Wayne a correction to your 11.08 interpretation of what I said.

        I meant open the borders now, go to Green and get Omicron all over by the 30 April. Everything I have read and heard is that it is more difficult to deal with in Winter than it is in Summer so it make sense to get it out of the way before Winter and most countries seem to take about two months to get on top of it.

        pdm1946

        January 24, 2022 at 12:42 pm

    • Tom I am not sure the Government is getting (or maybe accepting) advice from the MOH. Like Clark in 2020 Little seems to have been kicked into touch, and the main advice is coming from scaremongers Wiles, Baker, Hendy and Jackson.

      ps – I do not think either Clark or Little would have much to offer anyway but St. Ashley might but now he looks like a fall guy for Ardern, Hipkins and Robertson to use as they want to deflect attention from themselves.

      pdm1946

      January 24, 2022 at 8:07 am

  5. “Labour’s caucus retreat” ……sounds like a super spreader event…….

    alloytoo

    January 23, 2022 at 5:16 pm

  6. Vet: I’ve read Luxon’s attack on 3 Waters. It emphasizes the property rights part, nothing on the tribes. And nothing on the party website, despite my repeated communications with the party. I’ll criticise Seymour elsewhere. My understanding is that you’re a National man.

    Cassandra

    January 23, 2022 at 5:20 pm

  7. Cassandra … I find it interesting that an Actoid would turn a post highlighting the cant and hypocrisy of Ardern into an attack on National. Not sure either about your research ability. On 19 October 2021 National made the following announcement re Three Waters …. “The next National Government will repeal Labour’s Three Waters entity model and return any seized assets to councils …..”.

    What more do you want?

    The Veteran

    January 24, 2022 at 9:37 am

    • Something about the co-governance. If you read my comments that’s my request. I acknowledged the property side days ago. And as for your “Actoid” stuff, I’ve been a member of the National Party for 25 or more years. National has sat on the fence on the Maori co-governance thing incl the seats, for years, despite having policies – there’s never any action. John Key at a private dinner:”It’s not a high priority”. Simon Bridges at a Northern Club lunch:”It’d be too divisive”.

      Cassandra

      January 24, 2022 at 1:19 pm

    • I’ve been a member of the National Party for 25 or more years.

      😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂…..

      Dear oh dear. You’re a good National Man, Vet and I have to respect such loyalty, but you do let your tribalism take control a bit too much. It’s good to see Cassandra confirm it but based on other stuff he’s written I’d have been amazed if he’d turned out to be an “Actoid”.

      You’ve lectured me a bit about appealing to the Centre and “Politics 101”, but you guys in National better start realising that getting back into government and actually being able to change anything means not just appealing to a centre that’s been shifted Left by Labour, but also by coming up with arguments that might nudge them back to Right-wing policies and ideas a bit.

      Otherwise you’re either going to remain out of power as a shameless appeal to the centre loses you the voters who’ve stuck with you so far or you’ll find yourself utterly useless in government, wasting away six years or more simply fixing up Labour’s shambles, only to lose power to them again before you can actually set things up right for the future.

      That’s assuming you want to change anything. I have my doubts.

      Tom Hunter

      January 24, 2022 at 1:33 pm

      • To be fair, Tom, I see lots to admire in ACT and I support it too. We (National and ACT) have much in common, are in this together and both need to work in partnership. I have long argued that there should be no attacks. Vet is tribal and he needs to restrain that. I’m sure he recognises that the two parties are siblings.

        Cassandra

        January 24, 2022 at 2:31 pm

  8. And Vet: it’s not an attack on National, it’s an attempt to get National to act in accordance with its principles and policies. Which are the reason I have donated to National for about 30 years. I’m on National’s side – I just want those who represent my party in parliament to act in accordance with its policies.

    Cassandra

    January 24, 2022 at 1:22 pm

  9. Casandra … the opposition to co-governance goes hand in glove with the commitment to repeal Three Waters. Repeal Three Waters and there is nothing to ‘co-govern’. Suma suma with National’s position on the restructuring of the Health sector (1) dumb to even think about it in the middle of a pandemic and (2) the creation of a separate Maori Health Authority with veto powers over the decision making process is wrong and opposed. I’m not sure what else you are looking for.

    If I was wrong in labeling you and Actoid then I apologise. I don’t have any issue with opposing things in ‘our’ Party that I disagree with … I am uncomfortable with National’s position that mandates should be scrubbed once he country reaches 90% double vaccination. I think it would be more prudent to maintain the mandate for front line health professionals and close contact border workers subject to a sunset clause for abolition (renewable should circumstances so dictate).

    And don’t start me on nuclear ships visits. But as in most things the 80/20 rule is in play here.

    Tom … can I suggest that your focus and expertise is USA politics and long may it remain so. NZL politics ain’t like US politics for a whole variety of reasons which don’t need articulating here. NZL has pretty much always been governed from the centre right or the centre left. That’s not going to change and that’s why . why both ACT and the Greens will ever be bit players … nudging National and Labour in their respective directions and waxing and waning depending on the fortunes of their majority partner in crime. But rip, shit or bust agendas are never going to work. The centre remains a moveable feast but if you lose the centre you lose power. National found that out in 1993 with the fallout from the ‘Mother of all Budgets’ and the move to MMP and the introduction of tail wags dog politics. That’s the environment that governs the NZL political landscape. I agree with your contention that National has to come up with arguments that will shift the centre back to the the right and that’s the challenge made somewhat easier by Labour moving to implement policy for which they have no mandate.

    The Veteran

    January 24, 2022 at 2:37 pm

    • Can I suggest, then, that National take a more pro-active approach to getting its message across. For example, the Wikipedia entry on the MHA includes criticism by Judith Collins but nothing by Luxon, and nowhere does it say that National will repeal it. Indeed, googling MHA and National brings lots of Collins but no Luxon. This is really my point – it’s all very well to say that it’ll be gone by lunchtime but until the Leader says it it does not have credibility. I want a no ifs, no buts statement and not by Jim Bolger. I give this just as an example. The media and websites should be unequivocal. Now I’m sure that many MPs and many in the party such as yourself are clear that co-governance will be stopped in its tracks. I’m not so sure about Mr Luxon. Thank for the Actoid withdrawal. I’m happy to be called an ACT supporter. But do see my earlier comment regarding being a family.

      Cassandra

      January 24, 2022 at 3:45 pm

    • But rip, shit or bust agendas are never going to work.

      But see, that’s just the thing. As a Conservative I am very mistrustful of revolutions and revolutionaries; they almost always produce godawful results. That’s precisely what I don’t want. In that I’m even critical of the Rogernomics era precisely because of that, even though I fully supported its goals. I can agree with those on the Left who argue that it went too fast, even as I recognise that much of their criticism is not in good faith and that for them slower simply meant they had a better chance of strangling it at birth (as Douglas and Prebble well knew).

      But if we had started to make those changes a decade earlier, as Australia began too even before the arrival of Hawke in ’83, then we would not have needed a “revolution” and would not have had to endure so much pain in the late 80’s. You can put that reluctance down to Muldoon, but I think he was also perfectly fitted in his thinking and approach to you and much of the rest of the National Party. And thus…

      The centre remains a moveable feast but if you lose the centre you lose power. National found that out in 1993 with the fallout from the ‘Mother of all Budgets’

      So you almost lost the next election – key word is “almost”. For once National did what needed to be done, took the hits and then moved on. Just as the 4th Labour government did. By your standard they too were a failure by only staying in power for six years. But those six years counted.

      The longer you put off change and fiddle around the edges the worse things become, and eventually you get change, perhaps revolutionary change, forced on you. But perhaps that’s the National Party culture?

      … and the move to MMP

      Good example. Something Bolger and National could have stopped. God knows you had bi-partisan support from none other than Helen Clark.

      Tom Hunter

      January 24, 2022 at 5:22 pm

  10. And Vet, read Bill Ralston’s column in today’s Listener.

    Cassandra

    January 24, 2022 at 4:06 pm


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